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21 August 2013 @ 08:19 pm
Sims 4?  
SO I'm sure some of you have seen this video showing the first look at the Sims 4 gameplay.:

I'm wondering what your thoughts are on this.  I'm aware that this is a first glimpse and that there are many things I'm going to mention that will probably be elaborated on and explained at later dates.  I'm also not going to go into some of the things that I think are wrong with both this video and the official launch trailer in general, but here are my first impressions about the game from this video.

First up, the good things/things I think look interesting.

  • I do like the overall look of the sims in this (apart from the crappy hair).  Their faces seem to have a lot more definition than the TS3 puddings, and in fact they remind me quite a bit of TS2 sims, which is awesome.

  • CAS looks like it might be a lot of fun, and far more intuitive than TS3 CAS.  (I have a huge problem with TS3 CAS in that there are too many sliders and options.  I can never find the slider which alters the feature I want to alter in the way I want to alter it, and yet at the same time, they still seem very limited.  Plus I get bored mucking about in  the TS3 CAS very quickly, when I don't get bored in TS2 CAS).  I'm not sure if it'll be any easier to use than TS3 and TS2, but it looks more fun than TS3 that's for sure.

  • I like some of the building features a lot.  Being able to drag out rooms will be handy, as will being able to pick up and move whole rooms.

  • It looks like you can alter the height of the walls, which LOVE.  I use the constrain elevation cheat to make some of my walls taller when building, but it's very limited, and being able to properly alter the height of a wall is something I've wanted in TS2 for a long, long time.

  • Proper curbs!  No longer will the curbs be painted onto the road, and the road and pavement the same height.  That is something I'm very impressed by.

  • The animations don't look quite as lazy as TS3's.

  • The lighting looks good.  Far, far better than TS3 and TS2.

  • The objects don't look too hideous.

  • The plants look great.

  • Emotions.  Could be a very interesting concept.

Now the bad things/things I'm not sure about/things I want to know more about and I'm sure will be in later videos and news articles.

  • No news on personalities and how they will be determined.  The only thing the video mentions is being able to change the voice and style of walking to match the sims' personalities.  Nothing about how those personalities are formed.  Personally, I'm hoping that it'll be some combination of traits and personality points, and that if sims have interests still, they will also play a part.

  • It didn't show how to create diagonal walls, but one of the rooms did have one, so I'm assuming that this is still a feature.  I'm hoping that this is a feature we can control, and not that they only exist in those pre-programmed blue prints that there have been rumours of.

  • Still no curved walls.  :(

  • No look at whether or not CAST is still a thing.  I can see it, or an updated version still being part of the game, because a lot of people like it, but I loathe and detest it with a passion.  It's slow, and clunky and unintuitive and I hate, hate, hate having to save any colour or pattern I like after I've made my changes to it, so that I can use it again.  And that's just for walls and floors.  Don't get me started on how awful it is for clothing.

  • Only adults sims were shown in this.  I want  to know if slug babies are still a thing, or if they're going to go back in the direction of the adorable nooboos in TS2.  Also, are the toddlers and children going to still look like debil children?

  • No news on the genetic system yet.  This is a make or break thing for me.  I want a decent genetics system back before I even consider buying the game.

  • Emotions.  Yes they are intriguing and they could be interesting, BUT, and it's  big BUT, I'm not sure I like how EASY it is to manipulate them.  Pictures on the wall can make a sim feel flirty?  Okay I suppose, but only if they are romantic or erotic.  The picture in the video is neither.  And I'm not sure I want to have to pay that much attention to what I'm putting on my sims' walls.  I'd rather just go with what fits the room I'm decorating and the sims that live there.  Also, getting sad listening to the violin.  Okay, people, including myself, are moved by music in real life, but it all seems far too simple to me.  If my sims are going to have emotions, I want them to have depth.  I'm not getting that feeling from this.  I think they are going to be OTT and get old, fast.  One last also, I hope that the indicator on the UI for the emotion, isn't going to be as big as it was shown in this video, that that was just an overlay added for this to illustrate the point.

  • The hair.  I've read that these are apparently placeholder, low detail meshes put into the game whilst it's still being worked on and that the hair in the released product will be better.  I hope so.  I really hope so.  Yes I know there will be CC along eventually, but it'd be nice if the vanilla BG had nice hair in it.

  • The price.  £45 or £55 depending on the version.  Are you serious EA?

Really, that's it for now.  Am I excited?  Not really.  I've not seen enough to make me excited yet.  I've also not seen enough for me to hate it.  I seriously doubt that I will ever give up on TS2: there are too many things about it that I still love, even after nearly nine years, and I really can't see me being able to customise TS4 to be a Victorian hood as I have done with TS2.  Buuuut, TS4, might end up being a replacement for TS3 when I want to play a modern game, or play without caring too much about my sims.

What do you guys think about it?
Fuzzyfuzzy_spork on August 21st, 2013 10:39 pm (UTC)
Most of my initial thoughts are exactly the same as yours. But I'm trying very hard to keep my overall opinion saved for when the game is finally released. Too often they show these "gameplay" teasers and the finished game ends up being a lot different.

I do expect the emotions are going to get old fast. I would hope that it's a lot more complex than that... I want them to react to things based on their personality and experiences. Not just because there's a painting or a plant in the same room. e__e

I do like the way it all looks, visually, so far. Even the sims themselves! But the deal breaker for me is going to be how they've done their personalities. I've always wondered why they got rid of the points. If those were combined with the traits, it would make an almost infinite variety of Sim personalities and we could individualize them so much more than by just their looks! Traits are a neat idea, but I hate that they are all just Either/Or and there is no subtly to it.

I'm anxious to see what TS4 finally ends up being. I don't have any hopes about it, really. That way I won't be disappointed. :P
Didicreasy on August 23rd, 2013 05:14 pm (UTC)
Oh absolutely. I mean, I remember how different TS2 was to the preview disk I got with Making Magic (and yes, I know there was supposedly a server fire which wiped a lot of data), but even though TS2 was radically different, I still felt as excited when I first played it, as when I first watched the preview disk. I'm feeling no real excitement with this, which I suppose is better than the dislike I felt for TS3.

I really want the emotions to be more complex than was shown in this, and that this was just a teaser, using extremes to show what the sims are capable of. To me, the whole scenario would have been better if say Ollie went to serve drinks, but whilst he was away, the other one (Andre?) started playing the violin, which impressed what's-her-face. This then upset Ollie who did something to sabotage Andre's chances by say, playing the guitar better, and causing 'er-nibs to start paying more attention to him. That then made Andre angry, especially if she started flirting with Ollie because he's such a fantastic guitarist with level 10 creativity. Something like that would have more depth, but still be in keeping with the game. What was shown was just shallow.

Yeah, the way the game looks is really impressing me, much more than TS3. It looks like an upgraded TS2 with bells and whistles and I do really like it.

I found this video just now: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=-oMxVGmeO-s It shows more of CAS, which does look really good, BUT it also appears as if personality will still be determined by traits alone. I am so disappointed with this, I can't even tell you. My heart sunk. Traits are too one dimensional. Sims with the evil trait in TS3 all do the same things, yet TS2 sims with 1 or 0 nice points all act differently. Unless they have radically changed the way traits work, it's a reason for me not to get the game.

Edited at 2013-08-23 05:44 pm (UTC)
Fuzzyfuzzy_spork on August 23rd, 2013 06:33 pm (UTC)
I'm sure they added the emotions because everyone complained about how zombie-like and emotionless TS3 sims are. That dead-eyed gloomy thing they do while they stand there staring at nothing while their programming has them deciding what to do next was part of the reason I didn't like those sims. D: But if the emotions are, how you say it - SHALLOW like they showed in the teaser... guh.

After TS3 came out and I realized there were no personalities for the sims (or memories... but that's another rant) I was desperately hoping that TS4 would combine the personality points from TS2 with the traits. Because not all 1-nice-point sims are Evil, but to be able to have a 1-nice-point sim who had the brooding and evil traits would really set them apart from say, that 1-nice-point sim who had the hot-headed and ambitious traits. You could also have 1-nice-point sim who was eccentric and absentminded! ETC ETC! How fun that would be! Of course with the points you wouldn't need a few of those traits (like "neat" or "never nude") but I wouldn't miss them. e__e

The tweaked-out CAS is great, but I hope they've made the rest of the game that much better. WE'LL SEE. Next year. :P
Didicreasy on August 24th, 2013 09:39 am (UTC)
I wouldn't be surprised at that at all. TS3 sims are just so flat, so you don't get the amusing little idle animations you get with TS2. And part of that, I believe, is to do with them having traits and not personality points. EXACTLY! I have had so many sims in my legacy with very similar point spreads (including I don't know how many with only 1 nice point), and they have all acted very differently. You would not believe that Alexandra and Henry have only 1 point difference in their personalities (Alexandra is 5,9,9,3,1, Henry 5,8,9,3,1) by playing them. They act in completely different ways. I would love, love, love to be able to give Alexandra a "competent" trait, and Henry an "evil" trait to play along with that.

The new CAS (apart from the personalities) is encouraging. We will see indeed.
tatdatcmtatdatcm on August 22nd, 2013 03:11 am (UTC)
I'm a little more excited about Sims 4 than I was about Sims 3. I didn't really enjoy Sims 3 at all, but there were aspects I did like.

I like the idea of being able to click on body parts and adjust them and love the new ideas for building.

I'm hoping that installing CC will be easier for Sims 4 than it was for Sims 3 with the process being more like it is for Sims 2 where I just have to drop stuff in a downloads folder. Sims 3 CC just seemed too complicated to mess with to me.

It will be interesting to see what actual game play is like vs. what they've released in promo's so far.
Didicreasy on August 23rd, 2013 05:19 pm (UTC)
Yeah, same. I think that there is more that I like so far with TS4, compared to TS3, which I took an instant dislike to. And having had the game for about 18 months, along with several EPs, I can still say that I don't like TS3 very much. It's ok, but I get bored very quickly with it.

The new CAS does look amazing, and a hell of a lot of fun. At last you can create the exact bodyshape you want, which I do like a LOT.

Definitely. I have very little CC for TS3 when I do play, because it is just so fiddly to install and maintain. TS3 always seems to be patching (and yet the game remains broken), and that breaks a lot of cc out there.

I agree. This is still an early version of the game, and I'm interesting in how actually playing the game looks and feels.
miss_amarettomiss_amaretto on August 22nd, 2013 04:13 am (UTC)
Okay, I have to admit: I am WAY more excited for this than I ever was for ts3. I just never got into any of it. But for some reason... this seems really exciting so far. It seems like a Maxis game. It has a similar charm to it (for now) like TS did.

I have to agree with everything you liked. CAS looks interesting, and building looks easier for the building-impaired (such as I). However, like you said, how do we make diagonal walls? How do I make one wall?

Changing the voices and how they walk sounds very, very interesting. But like you said, no word on personality yet.

I just... want them to combine the two systems of ts2 and ts3. Because I love having the trait points, but traits sounded really interesting as well. Maybe it could be really interesting to make a sim who is "serious" but a "procrastinator" which then could cause him to lead a difficult life. Much more realistic.

I NEED to see the babies, tots and kids. Because if they are boring I'll upset. I also NEED to see how genetics work. From what I read, ts3 genetics are kind of bad.

Emotions sounds really interesting. I'm excited to learn more. Hopefully plants don't constantly make them cry.

MOST IMPORTANT (to me): is how will the "goal" system work. I really, really, really love choosing an aspiration. I really love choosing TWO aspirations. It gives a sim such depth. the whole idea of just choosing some one life goal in ts3 was completely weak and directionless. The aspiration system or "goal system" will totally make it or break it for me.

But I have to admit.... I need to know if I can create a historical 'hood too. D:
Didicreasy on August 23rd, 2013 05:29 pm (UTC)
Yeah, I'm definitely liking what I see more than what I saw with TS3 (and what I see when playing it).

I really want to know a bit more about building. I love me some diagonal walls, so being able to build them easily is a must. The same with single walls. Sometimes you just need a single wall to divide an area, even if you're not dividing it into two rooms.

I would really love that, but looking at the video I linked to in my reply to Fuzzy, that's not happening. At 7:41, it shows the personality screen in CAS, and there is a space for 5 traits, but no personality points. I'm really disappointed.

Still no look at the other age groups, but that same screen in the video, shows and age box, with 5 icons in it. It doesn't look anywhere near finished, which might be why we've not seen other ages yet, but I've been trying to work out what ages they could be giving us to choose in CAS, and if they're keeping the YA stage from TS3.

Emotions and how they are manipulated by the environment, is something I really want to know more about too.

Again looking at the video, it looks like aspirations are back. However, whether that is an aspiration like in TS2 (which, awesome), or similar to the life time goal in TS3 (shitty rubbish), there's no word on.

Oh yes, Customisation is a big thing for me. If it's not easy to make or install cc in order to customise a hood and my sims completely, then I'm not likely to be interested. I think that's another reason why I get bored of TS3: I can't make it look how I want.
penguingirl03penguingirl03 on August 22nd, 2013 01:25 pm (UTC)
Well that's the first preview that I have seen but then I haven't been paying much attention at all. Thanks for linking it!

I am intrigued but will wait to say if I am interested later. I bought parts of Sims 3 because they looked interesting but the glitches and the inability to play more than one household killed it for me. I really hope they don't have neighborhood aging on this one. I like the idea of emotions but they seem a bit like moodlets here and likely won't be as in-depth as we are all hoping for. If they combine personality points and traits though and fix the genetics I might just have to check it out.
Didicreasy on August 23rd, 2013 05:34 pm (UTC)
NP. I've linked to another preview in my answer to Fuzzy too.

Yeah, there are some bits which I want to know more about, but I'm not sure I'm going to buy it at all yet. I hope there's no hood ageing too. I don't like having to stick to one household in TS3 at all. I like to play lots of families, I always gave done since TS.

I really want to know more about the emotions, because I want to see if they are as shallow as they appear from that preview, or if they are going to be more in depth and manipulated in better ways than just sticking a few pictures on the wall and having someone play an instrument. (Although TS4 Emmi getting angry at someone playing the piano badly would be good).

Like I say above, it doesn't look like personality points will be coming back. There's a shot of the personality screen in CAS in the video I linked to Fuzzy, and there is room for traits, but no points. I'm so disappointed with that.
SilverBellesilverbelle1220 on August 22nd, 2013 07:21 pm (UTC)
I don't think I'm all that excited either. I gave up on TS3 after Generations, simply because the game just wasn't fun for me. A lot of it was how the game engine works (I need to have a certain number of friends to gain more charisma, and the friend building engine is impossible? NO THANK YOU), but the no-so-little things like the genetic borkage and how counter-intuitive it is was a deal breaker for me. I feel like the disappointment I went through going from 2 to 3 is affecting my enthusiasm of seeing what goes into 4.

That said, there are a few things that I like, such as the "dropping in" of a whole room (hello, spare houses!). But I don't see myself buying it when it comes out. Especially considering it's going to be way more expensive than I thought, and I am a poor student again.
Didicreasy on August 23rd, 2013 05:39 pm (UTC)
*nods* I've played TS3 for a bit more (I got Supernatural because I thought it'd be fun to play with the supernatural sims, and Seasons because I really missed weather when playing it), but it is just not the game for me. I lose interest in the sims and the world very quickly, and really miss being able to customise the game completely. I don't have CAW, so having to play a pre-made neighbourhood really does me in. Yes, exactly! the game just doesn't work because of the game engine. It gets old really quickly.

The build tools are something I'm interested in learning more about, definitely.

I couldn't believe the prices. They are ridiculous, so I think if I do get it, it'll be when it's on sale (which is what I did with TS3).
lauriempresslauriempress on August 23rd, 2013 01:20 am (UTC)
Okay, I'm pissed. I had a nice response to this and LJ ate it, and I didn't realize it until just now. *smacks LJ*

Yeah, my thoughts are pretty much like yours, it looks interesting, but I'm withholding judgement until I see a lot more.

Secondly, am I the only one that thought that the sim with the beret (there's a good picture at :53) looks a lot like your simself?
Didicreasy on August 23rd, 2013 05:41 pm (UTC)
Stupid LJ. *pokes it* I'm going to keep my eyes out for more videos. there's the one I linked to in my reply to Fuzzy, and I'm going to see if there are any more from Gamescom.

Haha. She did look a little like SimDi, yeah. :D
ms_norringtonms_norrington on August 26th, 2013 02:29 am (UTC)
I think everyone has made some great points. I will admit to feeling an actually spark of interest which I never got when TS3 came out. But like everyone, I'm reserving judgment until I see more and compare player reviews.

I do feel that this new game seems like they've tried harder to actually expand the gameplay and usability. I feel like I'm seeing something new and it's intriguing.

Of course it's really going to come down to how much control I'll have over the neighborhood. If I can't create and control my own neighborhoods, then I don't see this becoming a replacement for TS2. Not for me.

I am looking forward to more previews though :)
Didicreasy on August 26th, 2013 09:32 am (UTC)
Oh, yeah. I definitely feel more interest in this, than TS3, even if I have heard a few things which make me disappointed (traits instead of personality points again, emotions being very easily manipulated etc). The whole game just feels a little bit more like a "true" successor to TS2 at this point, if that makes sense. There are aspects of TS2 there, but it feels like a step forward with some of the features. Of course, there's still a lot more I want to know about it before I make up my mind.

I couldn't agree more. I love how easy it is to customise TS2, and customise it completely, not that vague "hey look, we're letting you change these channels, ain't we good at understanding what you want!" way TS3 works. Yesterday, I started seeing if I can replace the food ingredient meshes in TS2 with meshes which don't include sliced bread and milk cartons, and it turns out it's really easy to do. I found the files quickly using SimPe, and have been working away since. I have never been able to find the files I want using the third party tools out there for TS3. The workshop from T$R is the easiest of those to use, but it's limited by what it will find, and I don't know where to start for most things.

TS2 modding, well yes you need tutorials and you pick a lot of it up as you go along, but the only programme you need to find things in the game files, is SimPe, and it will find every type of game file, not just some.

Me too!
ms_norringtonms_norrington on August 29th, 2013 03:53 am (UTC)
I have heard a few things which make me disappointed; traits instead of personality points again, emotions being very easily manipulated...

I so hear you on this. I've putzed around with TS3 a bit and while I think the traits are cool at first sight, they're very cookie cutter and limiting when it comes to giving your sims diverse personalities. All evil sims steal candy and have the same mannerisms. It's fun the first time you see it but a family of evil doers loses it's novelty quick.

You made a good point about how in TS2 you can have sims with almost the same personality points (and in some cases exactly the same) who are in practice very different. I ended up with siblings who shared the same personality points and they were nothing alike yet they got along like a house on fire. I love that.

I wish TS4 could just mix the two, have points and traits. Now that would be interesting. Or at the very least give traits point values. Like how evil is someone on a scale of 1-10 or at least 1-5. A 10 will run around bitch slapping everyone while a 1 might set the sprinklers off at a party.

After watching that video I too am worried that now the whole emotion thing is going to be a very shallow. They looked far too easy to manipulate and unpredictable in an unrealistic way. It's not that I have a problem with a painting or music having a profound affect on a Sim's mood, but I'd prefer more subtlety. If they're so easily affected then you end up creating a very sterile environment to keep everyone even keeled. Or you can just have an entire neighborhood full of sims who should be medicated for all the hormonal shifts in their emotional states (I'm rambling so I hope that made sense).

I'm hoping the video simplified things just to make a point and that emotions in game are actually far more in depth. Fingers crossed :P